Talk:Cyclone

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Ravage and Torrent are not Cyclone effects[edit]

It was asserted here recently that abilities involving an "air time" component, such as Ravage and Torrent, belong in this article. However, through in-game testing, I have found that neither of these abilities render their unit A. untargetable or B. invulnerable to non-HP removal damage, and therefore are not Cyclone effects.

I first opened a solo lobby with cheats enabled. Then, I used -wtf mode to cast Torrent twice in quick succession on the same area. The following is the combat log:

[10:53.42] Kunkka hits Skeleton King with Torrent for 225 damage (2259->2034).
[10:53.42] Skeleton King receives Torrent debuff from Kunkka.
[10:53.42] Skeleton King receives Torrent Slow debuff from Kunkka.
[10:53.92] Kunkka hits Skeleton King with Torrent for 225 damage (2036->1811).
[10:55.46] Skeleton King loses Torrent debuff.

As you can see, the target, Skeleton King, received the damage and disable from the first Torrent at the same time. Then, 0.5 seconds later, before the disable fell off, received another instance of damage, which refreshed the disable. The debuff finally falls off 1.54 seconds after the second instance of damage, as it should. If Torrent did act as a Cyclone, Skeleton King would have been invulnerable in the air and would not have been affected by the second Torrent.

I tested a similar situation with Ravage and a separate damaging spell (in this case, Scream of Pain), and got this combat log:

[10:11.77] Skeleton King receives Ravage debuff from Tidehunter.
[10:12.13] Queen of Pain hits Skeleton King with Scream Of Pain for 225 damage (1879->1654).
[10:12.30] Tidehunter hits Skeleton King with Ravage for 337 damage (1655->1318).
[10:14.57] Skeleton King loses Ravage debuff.

Unlike Torrent, Ravage deals its damage after the "air time" component of the disable. You can also see that Scream of Pain successfully damaged Skeleton King after he received the disable from Ravage but before receiving the damage. Therefore, he was not invulnerable or untargetable while in the air.

Based on this data, I have definitively concluded that Torrent and Ravage are not Cyclones and will be removing them from the page, unless I am presented with compelling evidence to the contrary.

--Stupid Lemon Eater 15:43, 25 February 2013 (UTC)

I do believe that the effects are only applied because they are aoes, if you could test that for me. If not, sorry I wasted your time. D:
BTW, I don't like the caps for effects because its inconsistent with every other dota information source and general wikipedia policy, so I prefer to have them lowercase. I guess I haven't seen the policies on this wiki though. I'll check later.
Also, untargetable implies that they cant clicked on (eg starcraft campaign doodads) not that they cannot be affected by any attacks. (Targeting implies that an action uses a target to place it; prior to dots2, linkens sphere used to not block aoe unless the wearer was clicked on, for example.)--Immanot 04:34, 3 March 2013 (UTC)