Dota 2 Wiki:Discussion

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Wiki language transition[edit]

Preparations[edit]

Completely new (and initially empty) wikis would have to be spun up for each language you intend to keep.
The interwiki prefix table Special:Interwiki would have to be edited to point to each separate (non-english) instance
What do we do with /de /vi /th /pt-br pages?
If they stay on the english wiki, there's little point in moving /ru and /zh in the first place because we keep the hazard of language specific coding. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
I'm not 100% sure on which languages to keep. Ideally I'd like to keep, in order of importance: /ru -> /zh -> /pt-br -> /de -> /th -> /vi -> /es -> /fr. Everything else can go. But if that's too much work then everything after /de is negotiable. I just feel kinda bad for the people who put so much work into /vi and /th. - Lemoncake(talk) 10:51, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
User:SiegelZ would do /pt-br, User:Bu3ny and me could work on /de. Molldust (talk) 17:25, 4 January 2017 (UTC)
Wikis can only share the image store, everything else (i.e. all other namespaces) must be duplicated.
The only blocker is SMW regarding this issue. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Are all media files shared, sound/video etc? - Lemoncake(talk) 10:51, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
We've had some hiccups with sound files in the past, but i believe this had been fixed. I will ask in the new year. — Game widow (talk) 13:18, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
All the pages for a given language would have to be exported from the english wiki and imported to the new separate wiki
If this can be done automatically together with a page rename (Items/ru -> Items), it's no problem. Should probably be made for these four namespaces: main, main_talk, category, category_talk. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
"If" is a big word. To export all the Russian pages, for example, someone would first have to comb through your 40K+ pages and identify them. By default the export process only exports what you tell it to and the only grouping i know of to tell it to selected all pages within a category. Have a look at Special:Export, you'll see. If you can group all the pages you want to export into separate language-based categories, that would make the process much simpler. Any renaming then would take place between the export and the import. That involves manually editing the exported XML file, but it's entirely manual. Removing "/ru" from page names is a trivial search and replace, i agree, but translations of titles are page by page. — Game widow (talk) 13:25, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Including redirects, I find 11731 /ru pages, and 495 /ru categories. Medoke 18:34, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
We would keep the english page titles for the start. This way the links won't be as broken and the transition can be made over time with more editors. Molldust (talk) 23:24, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
All the templates would have to be duplicated on the new wikis and fixed to work in the new environment.
Category:Templates are not too many and it's a very good reason for a cleanup. They will work by default on the new wiki, they need no functional adaption. Only the translation strings will have to updated, but at least show english by default. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
All the links would have to be updated on both wikis
English links will not be affected by default. Non-en links will break and there's no way around it. Many pages will be moved to language specific names anyway. Bots will be able to fix selected links, but not all links in general. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Template:Lang would have to either be completely rewritten to work entirely differently, or removed (with all the work that goes into that since it's used by most of your templates)
I hope the template is gone once the the process is complete.
SMW properties will have to be redone on the other language wikis. High priority!
Redoing the properties is peanuts. Filling them with information is tricky because ideally we want to share the SMW values across languages. We should look at mw:Extension:External_Data or have any sort of plan for this. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
That's not one of our default extensions, so it would have to be submitted for vetting. I have no control over that process other than to ask for vetting process. If the extension is not accepted, what would you do? — Game widow (talk) 13:18, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
mw:Extension:Translate is very intrusive to the english pages and requires all non-EN pages to be retranslated. Furthermore it may not work across different subdomains anyway and is not part of the default extension set. I'm out of ideas honestly. Manually updating all stats and values on 3+ wikis doesn't sound manageable, if you have no means of comparing the translation progress between the pages. Molldust (talk) 23:24, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Figured out that SMW properties are incompatible... well that makes it easy. No more wrapping - everything will be done once by "hand/script". Molldust (talk) 17:25, 4 January 2017 (UTC)
English wiki must not break in the process!
By default, as long as only language pages are removed, this wiki suffers no damage. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
Will /zh-hans also be moved and called dota2-zh.gamepedia.com? If so, can we deprecate/remove zh-hant?
Ideally there would be a switcher thing between simplified and traditional, like Minecraft wiki does. It's not a huge priority though, most views are to /zh-hans. - Lemoncake(talk) 10:51, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
If minecraft uses some sort of switcher, i am unaware of it and you would have to coordinate with them to figure out what they do. — Game widow (talk) 13:18, 24 December 2016 (UTC)
This is great --Dotalim0204 (talk) 11:44, 7 January 2017 (UTC)
That's probably not even the full list of considerations
Feel free to edit and comment. Molldust (talk) 09:55, 24 December 2016 (UTC)

Migration process[edit]

We are ready to go my opinion. I don't know how the transfer works exactly. I guess it works like this:

Paging Game widow right now. Hopefully that's everything that must be done and good luck to the translators! Lemon might want to make a reddit announcement.

Responsibilities are most likely going to look like this. Doesn't mean everything has to work after a week, but just so that somebody can delete/move pages. Molldust (talk) 12:30, 21 January 2017 (UTC)

Subdomains dota2-ru dota2-zh(-hans?) dota2-pt(-br?) dota2-de
Bureaucrats  ? (Lemoncream)
Admins Medoke Elite stay
Dotalim0204
SiegelZ Bu3ny
Molldust
Bots MedokBOT
Molldust
rip dota zh-hant xD but may i know how that switcher works in template? --Dotalim0204 (talk) 03:14, 22 January 2017 (UTC)
In my opinion, PT is better than PT-BR. SiegelZ (talk) 03:33, 22 January 2017 (UTC)

New Subdomains Are Ready (Admins please read!)[edit]

All four new language wikis have been set up. Users in the brackets will be assigned administrator positions. In order for me to make you an admin, you must log in to the site first! - Lemoncake(talk) 18:29, 23 January 2017 (UTC)

User:Game widow is in the process of importing all templates from the English wiki. Priority on non-English wikis should be mostly on keeping hero, item, and mechanics pages up to date. Everything else (hats, etc) are less important.

List of tasks that need to be done to finish the migration (add more if needed):

  1. Fetch all /lang pages with a query
  2. Export all /lang pages with Special:Export
  3. Rename all pages and links from Page/lang to Page on a local PC
  4. Import to the new wiki via Special:Import
  5. Complain about all the broken stuff
  6. Fix everything
  7. Delete the /lang pages from the en wiki
  8. Remove language templates from all templates
  9. Make reddit announcement once all wikis are presentable
ok np --Dotalim0204 (talk) 07:08, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

Talent infobox, adding to "sources of..."[edit]

Like items and skills, there should be a simple infobox for eg Viper first Lvl 20 talent, so they can be added to "sources of..." pages.

Evasion, cooldown reduction and spell amplification all need the talents added to them. The 4 spells and items which grant gold can now have all the +passive gold talents added to the list, and Respawn time could be tweaked to replace the huge table with a simple list, followed by the ways the respawn timer can be altered (bloodstone, scythe, list of talents, buyback adding time to next death)

Personally I think all the talents which add stats or improve traits based on str/agi/int can be added to the relevant pages, but shouldn't be mixed in with the current lists.

Of course it would be nice, but we just don't have the time to do this for every mechanics page. Any volunteers would be welcome. - Lemoncake(talk) 22:55, 10 January 2017 (UTC)
Work in progress: Template:TalentListRich Molldust (talk) 21:30, 10 January 2017 (UTC)

Maintenance templates[edit]

What do you think would be the best template name for an article/section that is currently being updated / constructed?

Same question for an article that lacks specific information that is not obtainable (as opposed to a Template:Stub where the info is simply not inserted yet.)?

What to do with the following?

Molldust (talk) 18:02, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

I use Template:Updating if I currently work on something, and Template:Outdated if something needs updating but I don't work on it currently.
Template:Needinfo should stay as it is, since it serves a different purpose. I never had the need for an ambox version of it. Also, Template:Help wanted is good enough for this.
Intromissing seems pointless. I'd remove it.
~~ Bu3ny (talk) 18:49, 28 January 2017 (UTC)
Template:Updating, Template:Outdated, Template:UnderConstruction and Template:Needinfo are the ones we use these days, all the other ones are from long ago when the wiki was being set up. - Lemoncake(talk) 19:04, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

I like the Gear page for heroes. Shouldn't those pages also list emoticons and equipment for other heroes which references them, like Treant's default skin (bark?) having "riki was here" on riki's page, and the tiny axe plushie on that witch doctor item?

Subwikis with flag[edit]

Example: Earthshaker
Not? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ SiegelZ (talk) 19:40, 18 March 2017 (UTC)

It's a good idea IMO, not sure how to implement across wikis though - Lemoncake(talk) 04:07, 19 March 2017 (UTC)
Molldust said that this could be automated so that they appear on their own when the pages exist. ~~ Bu3ny (talk) 11:41, 19 March 2017 (UTC)
I only mentioned that the current system is outdated with the lang tags on the page itself and a new system is in place for Wikipedia, called WikiData. It acts as a central wiki where all languages register their localized page to the according english page. Here in this example the flag is just an alternative display of the Language section in the left menu bar. Maybe there's a way to do this with CSS and JS only, but it's way easier to modify the skin itself (current one is Hydra). None of us has access to the backend code, so scrap this. Inserting a template such as pt:Template:Lang1 doesn't sound very promising tbh. Molldust (talk) 14:17, 19 March 2017 (UTC)
"doesn't sound very promising" Okay ._. I thought it was a good idea because the Mobile version did not display subwikis on my smartphone, only in the Desktop version SiegelZ (talk) 19:12, 19 March 2017 (UTC)

On mobile there should be a button at the end with the label "Read in another language" (it's there for me). You should post the issue on Slack with your Android/iOS version and mobile browser.

The problem with the template is that you have to insert it at every page, that's why I don't find it promising. There are ways to do it with JS and CSS, but it's like digging a hole with a spoon. And I know it's easier by modifying the skin itself. That's the thing with 3rd party wiki hosts, you have to work with what you have. Molldust (talk) 21:12, 19 March 2017 (UTC)

What do we do with undocumented change?[edit]

Such as AA's lvl 20 right talent got changed to +400 HP in 7.06. --66.76.81.9 05:26, 17 May 2017 (UTC)

Already included in version changes. Medoke 09:20, 18 May 2017 (UTC)

Correct spelling of 'esports'[edit]

The Associated Press' 2017 AP Style Guide officially spells the word "esports", and so should we. No "eSports", "e-sports", "E-Sports" or similar.

It is similar to how "e-Mail" transformed with usage to "email".

Here and here is an article on that matter. The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tim3303 (talk) • (contribs)

I don't think it's a biggy, but sure, you can change it to "esports" wherever you find it spelled differently on the wiki. --Psion1C (talk) 10:18, 18 May 2017 (UTC)